Funny Stuff
On Monday, Tom Kirkendall and I were both surprised when the Chronicle's Richard Justice wrote the following:
The Texans are respectable. They're coming close. They've got four 2-7 teams left on their schedule. They almost won in Jacksonville, and they made a run at the Indianapolis Colts before losing 31-17 Sunday.
The Texans might be coming close to becoming respectable, but even that's debatable. They are a really bad football team.
Today, Justice wrote the following:
UH thinks big. It wants an invitation to join the Big 12. Athletic director Dave Maggard even has a prominent school ready to join UH in making it a Big 14.
Ah, yes, the man who couldn't even convince a Nebraska team that desperately needs to recruit Texas to honor an agreement to play UH at Reliant is negotiating the entry of UH and a mystery team into the Big 14. Come on now. I wonder if Justice wasn't just having a little fun with Maggard by committing that to print. :)
As I said in a comment earlier today, I'll be pretty happy if UH can simply win its next two games, both against inferior opponents it should beat.
Posted by Kevin Whited @ 11/15/05 23:09 | Sports | Technorati
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You mean he found another team *willing* to join the Big 12? What amazing skill that must have taken. Unless it's Arkansas, one imagine any other concievable candidate (New Mexico, Colorado State, TCU, or some other Texas school) probably would not need terribly much convincing. Suggesting that as progress is something like saying you've practically made a movie cause you bought some film.
Posted by RAW @ 13:25 on 11/16/05
The Texans couldn't fill the stands if they gave away the tickets.
Posted by Laurence Simon @ 14:32 on 11/16/05
FYI raw, scuttlebutt is that school in question is either Arkansas, or Iowa from the Big Tenelven.
So yes, it is a big improvement since UH understands that they will have to package themselves with another school to be successful.
I know for a fact that Maggard also feels UH' best chance for long term viability lies in the Big XII. He's courted teams, smoothed over old sores, and if a vote were held today for a two-team package that included UH some observers believe it would be 10-2 for. With the two no votes belonging to UT and aTm. (no surprise there)
Not that this vote is imminent, I think it's doable in 5 years if UH can get some success in football (possible) and basketball (highly probable).
If they do that the fans will come back to a certain extent, maybe 20-25K per football game and selling out the HOF.
That would probably be enough.
BTW: The big XII has already put copyrights on the name Big XIV. Including the web domain etc.
Maybe not as far fetched a plan as everyone thinks.
Provided Maggard can continue to turn things around on Cullen Ave.
S.
Posted by Sedosi @ 09:14 on 11/17/05
Does anyone give any concrete reasons for Iowa trying to make that move?
Leaving the Big Ten for the Big 14 would be a big step down academically. I can't imagine Iowa's academic leadership standing for that. Indeed, over the years the academic leadership at Mizzou has always fretted about that aspect of the conference, viewing themselves as a more natural member of the Big Ten academically.
I don't mind Maggard's big dreams, but TCU is well ahead of UH at this point in-state, and UTEP has surged ahead this season. We need to have the third best football program in the state, and the conference affiliation will take care of itself.
The job Jim Leavitt has done at South Florida (from no football program to Big East in how many years?) is proof of that.
Posted by Kevin @ 09:25 on 11/17/05
TCU's disadvantage, I think, is that it has a lot more in common with Baylor than does any other candidates. Except that TCU has less students and less alumni base. They do have Fort Worth, though, which is an improvement over Waco. Of course, UH has a lackluster fan-base and I'm not sure why 25-30k would even be remotely attractive to the Big 12 when they have the Texas market cornered.
I think the most likely candidates would either be to capture newer markets (New Mexico), strengthen existing markets (Colorado), or name schools (Iowa, Arkansas, though I'm not really sure why either would be that interested).
I have difficulty imagining any of those schools making UH's inclusion a condition of joining the conference. Nor can I imagine them taking two more Texas teams. Unless UH can build prominance with the C*USA *and* build up attendance without being a member of the Big 12, I have difficulty seeing it happen.
Posted by RAW @ 11:53 on 11/17/05
Arkansas is in the middle of realizing that the move to the SEC was a terrible decision. Their recruiting has gone down, their revenues have dropped etc. The big dollar alumni over there (yes, it seems like an oxymoron I know) are quietly pining for the old SWC days when they consistently recruited top Texas talent.
Raw is right on with TCU. Not only are they Baylor, they are a SMALLER version of Baylor.
As for Iowa? They have been quietly losing ground in the in-State recruiting battle for a few years now to Iowa State. Even though it's down this year, the Big XII is quietly turning into the 800 lb recruiting gorilla in the Midwest. Iowa looks down South and sees a furtile Texas recruiting market with players galore.
Plus, the Big Tenelven doesn't seem to be too anxious to create a League Championship game, most of the old line are taking the "Notre Dame or nothing" stance and some schools feel that that is setting them back.
UTEP was good last year, they are good this year, and will be good up until the point Mike Price leaves town. (no more than two years tops) after that they'll be back to a 5-6 team with an occasional spike to 7-4. (i.e. UH right now) the difference is they are in a remote location with zero attraction, and are part of the UT system.
That leaves UH. The reason Arkansas or Iowa would be willing to join forces with the Coogs is because they realize there HAS to be a South team on board to balance the scales.
UH's attendance woe's would be solved overnight by inclusion into the Big XIV. Overnight. The Big XII knows this and the requirement would be placed on UH that all home games are to be played at Reliant until Robertson could be sufficiently expanded.
The expansion COULD be aided by the arrival of an MLS team to Houston. Reliant has already put the kabosh on soccer being played there, since McNair wants nothing to do with owning a soccer team, and he really doesn't want to be a landlord.
The three remaining sites are Rice University (major refurbishments needed and new turf just to get off the ground) Delmar Stadium (too small) and Robertson. (needs some refurbishments in lighting and the press box, and would probably need field turf installed but much less needed than over at Rice - which is too bad btw.)
Add to all of that that Maggard is no dummy, and I think there may be something to this. Plus I've been privvy to some conversations between Maggard and local football insiders that leads me to believe this is more than just throwing mud at the wall.
A LOT still has to happen and UH NEEDS to increase attendance some, but the buzz is that the USM win on Sunday was HUGE.
Hell, it even got us front page in the Chronicle sports section and a write up from Justice...how often does that happen?
Posted by Sedosi @ 12:08 on 11/17/05
One more thing:
I believe that basketball, moreso than football, will lead the way in any UH resurgence.
It's happened before: See Cincinatti.
And USF is in the Big East because Miami is in the ACC. They needed the Florida exposure. Sure has worked out for them hasn't it?
Their average attendance in 2002 was in the 20's. (they are in the low 40's now)
UH can get there with one or two winning seasons.
Posted by Sedosi @ 12:15 on 11/17/05
>> UH's attendance woe's would be solved overnight by inclusion into the Big XIV. Overnight. <<<
Overnight?
This I do not believe.
If UT, A&M, or even OU scheduled a "home" game at Reliant (much as Kansas did at Arrowhead this year), they would draw twice as many fans as a UH-Iowa State or UH-Mizzou matchup. Tomorrow, anyway (you did say overnight).
Start putting up Jim Leavitt's win numbers for 4-5 years, and that might start to change.
Hell, UH couldn't even fill up tarp-covered Hofheinz last season at the end of the season, when there was a real chance to make the NCAAs. We came close a few times, and it was surely exciting (I think I missed one home game). It will be better this year, as Penders has raised the profile by being competitive, but I doubt we'll see a sellout Tuesday, and I have my doubts about the Arizona game. I hope I'm wrong on both counts, but I bet I can't find anybody to bet on a sellout Tuesday. :)
We need the football program to string some wins together, instead of finding ways to lose to inferior opponents. These next two games are really important. I hope we don't overlook 'em.
I still don't see any way Iowa's academic leadership would ever give up the comparative prestige of the Big Ten.
And however much we want to knock TCU and UTEP, UH is clearly inferior to them right now in football. Until UH changes that, no prestige football conference is going to be at all interested, nor are many fans going to be that interested. Too many entertainment choices in Houston!
Posted by Kevin @ 13:21 on 11/17/05
Overnight. Not because UH fans would come, but because UT, aTm and OU fans would come to Reliant to watch the games.
It was much the same in the old SWC days whether Cougar fans like to admit it or not.
The way this programs leaking money I don't think they'd care much WHO's fans were there, just fans period.
Sad? Yup, but the hard truth.
Yes, TCU and UTEP are better now, but they still have too many limitations placed on them.
Notice I said UH needs to string together two to three bowl years and get attendance up over 20K before anything happens.
Still, in four or five years I think this could be a possibility.
Prediction: UH basketball get's off to a strong start and they will sell out the Hof this year.
Posted by Sedosi @ 16:07 on 11/17/05
Overnight. Not because UH fans would come, but because UT, aTm and OU fans would come to Reliant to watch the games.
You're never going to have a season when all of those teams play in Houston against UH. At most, you get two of 'em in one season. And then you've got your other 3-4 home games with attendance of maybe 20,000 if current behavior is any indicator (and you did say overnight, so we have to assume current behavior). UH-Kansas or UH-Iowa State isn't going to draw many fans overnight, even though the games might actually prove interesting.
Now, I'll agree with you that if we can throw together some 7/8/9 win seasons and be dominant in CUSA within 3-4 years and boost attendance, then maybe there's a shot at it... although I would prefer the SEC (whole other topic).
I understand Maggard has to give the dwindling fan base something to get excited about, but this city's sports fans are pretty tough about wanting to see results on the field before getting excited. UH has to stack up some W's and quit giving games away to inferior teams. They do that, and there could be good things ahead.
Posted by Kevin @ 16:53 on 11/17/05
personally I'd like to see a grudge match between the Texans and Ball HS... I suspect Ball would be favored....
Posted by Rorschach @ 16:54 on 11/17/05
Sedosi, I'm relatively confident that Arkansas would be the south team. May not be quite right geographically, but I'm willing to bet that they would be perfectly happy to overlook that for the sake of the UT rivalry and the long tradition of matchups (which they do not share in the north). I think they'd be more likely to bend that way than UH's way. I just don't think that the bump they would get in Houston attendance would be enough for UH's weakness compared to the others.
Trademarking aside, I honestly don't see the Big 12 expanding in any event. I don't think Arkansas or Iowa would be interested (though you make a good point as to why Arkansas might, recruiting) and I don't think that Colorado State, New Mexico, or any of the other Texas schools bring enough to the table to justify splitting the spoils 14 ways instead of 12 (and Colorado may have objections to CSU).
I think in some ways the SEC might indeed be a better fit. It would be there entrance into the Texas market. Should the Big 12 expand to 14 with Arkansas, though, there would be an opening with no obvious candidate to fill it. But it would be less fun from a fan standpoint.
In any event, I'm not even convinced that a TCU-caliber team would be enough to garner the interest of the Big 12 or the SEC. But fielding a TCU-caliber team would sure be a lot more fun.
Posted by RAW @ 20:31 on 11/17/05
TCU? No alumni base? How about Dan Jenkins and Billy Clyde Puckett and them?
Posted by another precinct chair @ 16:01 on 11/18/05
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